Bin Laden is DEAD!

[AndyHB]

... then having him as a living captive could have yielded very valuable information.

but also a focus for disruption, attempts to release him, etc., etc.

Swings and roundabouts, in my view - though still not my 'preferred' option.

[Martin]

Article.

[Boudi]

What conspiracy? Well the notion that Obama has been holding off the take out until it was a political booster for him. That's crazy.
No Boudi, I have not seen the footage. I admit to being a strong supporter of the States. Mom's from Nebraska. I will tell you that even though I'm no fan of democrat Presidents, I can't believe that Obama and his people wouldn't realize the intense scrutiny this is going to get. I take him at his word on this one.
I always felt the Pakistani military brass was playing a double game. The US may have known for a while where Osama was but the Pakistani's always knew. It's not credible that they didn't.

If you take Obama's word then why do you think he was armed?  Also, you can support someone's position, but you don't haver to back them.  This was certainly an execution carried out in another sovereign state without their knowledge

[Boudi]

I do think it's possible that Osama lioved there without people knowing.  Fred west killed folk and buried them in his garden for years, and he lived in a terrace.  You've got a big house with a high wall owned by someone who isn't Bin Laden.  If he doesn't bring the milk in each morning there's a chancve he can make porridge without being recognised!

[pow wow]

Boudi you do realize that the military brass of Pakistan has had close ties to the Taliban for years. Now who was a close comrad of the Taliban? Osama. The military may officially be at war with the Taliban but Taliban support in the pakistani military remains strong. There's no doubt about that. You actually think Osama was able to live in a luxurious compound right next door to a Pakitani military base and no brass was in on it? Oh well, I won't try and convince you of the obvious. A man with a price on his head and that man being a leader of a terrorist organization. That man being the most wanted man in the world doesn't go to bed at night unarmed. He is always armed. That's quite elementary. Was he firing a weapon? I don't know, but he was in the sense that his soldiers, his goons were firing on his behalf. There is no doubt about that. Some times one has to step on toes to get the job done. Pakistan is a sovereign nation but so what. They are playing a double game and were we to follow your rules Osama would have been able to live in luxury for the rest of his life because Pakistan is a sovereign state. Serbia is a sovereign state and look what we had to do there. We could do nothing about ethnic cleansing, why? Because Serbia is a sovereign state. No, there are times like these where this word sovereign is meaningless to me.

[Boudi]

sounds like evasion.  America says  he was unarmed...you know his sleeping arrangements.

[Martin]

He was unarmed.  And now it looks as if he was captured before he was killed. His body was disposed of post haste, such that it could not be exhumed.  What would a post-mortem have revealed about the manner of his death?

Of course I don't know about the manner of Osama's death, but I do know that the USA was involved in the practice of moving prisoners to countries where they would be tortured. I do know that the USA still has many prisoners locked up in Guantanamo without even the prospect of a trial. I do know that the Americans invaded Iraq on the basis of there being 'incontrovertible evidence' of weapons of mass destruction.  So I know that we are dealing with a country which has been untruthful in the past about many connected things.

I would not be surprised to find that there never was a global organisation called Al Quaeda, but rather a number of disparate groups who appropriated the name to make them sound more dangerous, and in doing so, played into the hands of the politicians in the USA who used the name to convince the voters that they were protecting the world from a massive Islamic threat, while really making sure that they held strategic military positions when the global fight for oil and gas hots up.

[AndyHB]

Debate here seems to be becoming circular - now, how unusual is that

[tranchiebabe]

I wonder if those who think Bin Laden should have had mercy would have felt so kindly disposed towards him if one of their rellies had been killed on 9/11?

I think Obama is right not to release the picture of him, as it is likely to lead to more trouble. Besides which what does a picture prove for heaven's sake? Those who just love conspiracy theories would claim it was faked anyway. I hear the horrible Sarah Palin wanted it released, she would! God help us if she ever became president, Bin Laden would look like a pussycat compared with her! 

[Jan]

I wonder if those who think Bin Laden should have had mercy would have felt so kindly disposed towards him if one of their rellies had been killed on 9/11?

There seem to have been mixed reactions from those who actually have loved ones who got killed in  911. Douglas Eaton, who lost his son, Robert, 37, said bin Laden should have been brought to trial.

Read more: http://www.metro.co.uk/news/862172-relatives-of-9-11-victims-have-mixed-reactions-to-osama-bin-laden-death#ixzz1LT3W4j00


http://www.metro.co.uk/news/862172-relatives-of-9-11-victims-have-mixed-reactions-to-osama-bin-laden-death

I think Obama is right not to release the picture of him, as it is likely to lead to more trouble. Besides which what does a picture prove for heaven's sake? Those who just love conspiracy theories would claim it was faked anyway.

I personally would not want to see a picture of him shot in the head anyway, but yes it would likely cause more trouble - and there are likely to be others who will no doubt 'follow in the footsteps' of their martyred leader, who would seem to have got the death he wanted.

All those lives lost - killing him does not bring them back. The pain of losing a loved one in this way - killing him does not make that go away. Does it even make this world any safer?

Considering all the people that piece of vermin was responsible for killing taking him out was a good job done. I would have done it myself without the slightest qualm had I been given the opportunity. I would have had no more conscience about doing so than disposing of a rat, less so probably.

Could you really have done so? Its easy enough to write on a forum in anger isn't it, but could you really have done so?

I know I could not. To do so would not make me feel any better even though I know what he has done. In fact I would feel quite empty inside - like I had killed something inside of me (sunk to the killers level). That does not mean I don't think he should 'know' the pain and hurt he has caused others. My understanding is that he will know as we all will  (compensation and Retribution for all Good and Evil Deeds Done on Earth).

[tranchiebabe]

Could you really have done so? Its easy enough to write on a forum in anger isn't it, but could you really have done so?

Without a shadow of a doubt! I know what I am capable of, and killing someone like that in those circumstances would be well within my remit. I would want to be a combatant in time of war!

[Jan]

Could you really have done so? Its easy enough to write on a forum in anger isn't it, but could you really have done so?

Without a shadow of a doubt! I know what I am capable of, and killing someone like that in those circumstances would be well within my remit. I would want to be a combatant in time of war!

In a time of war if faced with someone who was about to kill then I would try to defend myself (or others) or try to get out of danger. If that meant having to kill then I would probably (like most of us) go off basic human survival instincts for that time. I would not take any pleasure in killing another though - I would try another way if one were possible rather than kill.

I wonder if those who think Bin Laden should have had mercy would have felt so kindly disposed towards him if one of their rellies had been killed on 9/11?

The situation with BL is rather different - and I would not call it showing 'mercy'.

To choose a stance as JJ posted (part of it is Martin Luther Kings words) well some might call that a weakness. Do those that believe it to be a weakness not think that anger and sorrow is still felt by those striving for peace, when innocent people are murdered?

It takes a lot of strength not to seek revenge!

[tranchiebabe]

Where Bin Laden was concerned it was a state of war against terror.

[Jan]

Where Bin Laden was concerned it was a state of war against terror.

yes but terrorists would usually have to face a trial

[tranchiebabe]

Well the so and so is dead, will not be standing trial so that really is an end to it!