Are we a Christian country?

[Boudi]

Dawkins suggest we are not, because fewer than the last census would tick the box.  He further goes on to say that those claiming it don';t believe it.

We'd best leave aside the point that when asked to give the full title of the Origin of the Species he did say "oh God!".

So, are we a Christian country, and if we are, how are we?  Th examples of prayers before meetings seem to me to be historical and traditional.  No new group formed even suggests that prayers would be welcome or necessary.  We have a head of State who is the head of the State religion, but again, this is very historical. Does it make a difference that we are a Protestant Christian country?  I know that Saundthorpe pbuh, used to be fond of making the point that we lived in a Christian country, but was less happy with the thought that we were a Protestant Christian country.

[AndrewF]

I don't thinmk it is a simple 'yes or no' question. We are a multi-faith country, with a legaal amd moral code based on Christianity, which all the faiths now present have to accept - and mostly do as their faiths (excluding extreemist ellements) on the whole support the golden rule at the heart of Christianity in terms of relating to other people (which is what the laws of the land are concerned with) - that of 'do as you would be done by'.

[Boudi]

So again its down to history and tradition, rather than the now.  We have in past had laws that force people to go to church, that penalise Catholics, that persecute Jews and pagans, but they are (on the whole) dropped now.  So aspects of an obvious Christian lawcode have perhaps slid in favour of laws that on the whole are in line with ethics raher than religious laws.

[saundthorp]

Dawkins suggest we are not, because fewer than the last census would tick the box.  He further goes on to say that those claiming it don';t believe it.

We'd best leave aside the point that when asked to give the full title of the Origin of the Species he did say "oh God!".

So, are we a Christian country, and if we are, how are we?  Th examples of prayers before meetings seem to me to be historical and traditional.  No new group formed even suggests that prayers would be welcome or necessary.  We have a head of State who is the head of the State religion, but again, this is very historical. Does it make a difference that we are a Protestant Christian country?  I know that Saundthorpe pbuh, used to be fond of making the point that we lived in a Christian country, but was less happy with the thought that we were a Protestant Christian country.

Hi Boudi,
I think as time goes on it will become ever more difficult to call ourselves a Christian country. This country has been running on the legacy of past Christianty for some years. That legacy is nearlly all spent. I would like to think I'm wrong, but the omens for the future are not good.

[Boudi]

I think you're right...we can say it, but I don't think we can prove it or demonstrate it!  Maybe it would be good if we could show that we were a tolerant, and positive society.  Part of being a Christian country in the past is that we persecuted the Jews, the protestants, the catholics, the anabaptists etc, all in the name of faith, and I'm sure we could say that that's not really what christianity should be about...but it's part of the legacy, and perhaps its the reason people don't want it.

[AndrewF]

Persecution is not a truely Christian characteristic. It is a perversion of Christianity. I agree that the politics referred to it as being for the sake of the faith, but I would argue that generally it was at least as much about 'tribal' power-struggles - keeping 'my' lot in power....
Before we can decide the answer I think we need to define what it is to be Christian, and whether we are talking about the country as (for the lack of a better description!) an institution - or perhaps as an organic entity of its own - or whether we are talking about the behaviour of the majority of the population or the avowed religion of the majority or even the actual faith of the majority - 4 different questions I would suggest... (the last but 1 being the easiest - just look up the result of the last census!)

[Boudi]

 0o|er...was that an answer.....it reads like questions....i like.

[AndrewF]

Well - I guess it is was rather in the line of the Rabinic tradition of answering one quesation by posing another one!
However it was not intended that way, but more as an attempt to clarify exactly what the question is that we are trying to answer...

[Boudi]

Then it seems that the whole 'christian' tradition is up for questioning, but it seems that persecution of the Catholics was a Christian act....unless we are going to add the rose tinted specs to the whole perspective.  People attended church...partly because they wanted to...partly because there was nothing else to do...partly because its where their boss went to show off his best clothes and demanded an audience, and sometimes because you'd be fined for not going.

I'd love to be  able to closely define the question...but the concept is out there, and you may have hit a certain nail on the head, in that you can't easily define a concept like christianity, and then apply it on a nation that wouldn't know where to start

[AndyHB]

Have we ever been a Christian country?  Is it actually possible to be an 'X' country (replace X with any world faith). 

[AndrewF]

I think we have certainly been (in the past) a country which though of itself as Christian, in that there was only one religion in the country (with the exception of a few Jews & Gypsies), and everyone who adhered to any religion adhered to that one,and the government was made up of people who at least claimed to be following the Christian religion. Whether the acts performed in the name of that religion were always what we would now consider to be Christian is another matter!

[Boudi]

I do find this really interestingf, that the times we see as being more Christian are the times we may have been further away from it!  I wonder to what extent it can be a state response, rather than an individual one?

[AndrewF]

I think the state can set the parameters to make it easier or harder, but that in the final anaysis it has to be the individual response - or rather the sum of all individual responses - which decides if it is a 'Christian' country or not

[AndyHB]

Have we ever been a 'Christian country'?  What does the term actually mean?  Can you actually have such a thing?  I suppose the nearest one would get to a true 'Christian state' would be one in its first generation of belief where each member of the tribe, community, ... had each made a decision to become a Christian.

I know that this is a 'repeat' of an earlier post, but I've tried to expand what I was trying to ask/say.

[Boudi]

I thin k you'd need an agreed definition of Christian!  I'm reminded that Ghandhi was asked what he thought of christianity...he replied that he thought it would be a good idea