Taking it on the chin for someone else

[AndyHB]

Much has been written and spoken over the last week or two over the rights and wrongs of asking someone else to take speeding penalty points for you as a result of the situation that Chris Huhne finds himself in.  I realise that we already have a thread entitled 'loyalty and morality and grey areas', but I'd like to take the issue on a different tack.

Clearly, the Huhne Affair has been blown out of proportion because of the nature of the acrimonious divorce the two protagonists are involved in and has, to a degree, hidden the more fundamental issue of whether or not it can be right for someone - perhaps a spouse - to take points on their licence so that their spouse can continue to use their car for work (something that seems to be very common amongst the families of truckers and others who rely on a licence untainted by penalty points - or 3 at the most).

Yes, it is against the law, but what about those cases where a couple use the same car and the same road at fairly similar times of the day - perhaps one drives home from work, only for the other to drive to work or to fetch a child 10 or 15 minutes later?  Heard this on one Radio 5 programme where a lady said that this had happened to her and her husband: she took the points as she was only an occasional driver, whereas her husband was a sales rep - with him paying the fine.

[EliB]

Heard this on one Radio 5 programme where a lady said that this had happened to her and her husband: she took the points as she was only an occasional driver, whereas her husband was a sales rep - with him paying the fine.

I obviously get why folk do it - but in said example above....the offence was HIS, the punishment should have been made to be HIS too....yes, so that would have made life difficult for the family all round....so maybe he'd then think twice in the future and therefore not risk more points to risk his licence altogether!!!!  Personally, I'd make the person agreeing to take the points as guilty as the person trying to offload them. Actions have consequences - it's time folk realised it and stopped trying to get out of taking responsibility for their actions!!!

[AndyHB]

I obviously get why folk do it - but in said example above....the offence was HIS, the punishment should have been made to be HIS too....yes, so that would have made life difficult for the family all round....so maybe he'd then think twice in the future and therefore not risk more points to risk his licence altogether!!!!

I'm sorry, having just reread my OP, I've realised that I had left out a rather important detail.

The letter came to the wife, as she was the owner of the car, but both she and her husband had driven the car down that road several times that day - for whatever reason - so they weren't sure who had been driving at the time of the incident.  They therefore asked for proof, but the photo they had back wasn't sufficiently clear to indicate who was in the driver's seat and, as it came 2 or 3 weeks after the event, they weren't actually sure about the various times they had been driving.  THAT is why they split the punishment.

[EliB]

Hey Andy - lol - well, yes, that does kind of make a bit of a difference! 
So she took the most affecting part of the punishment and he the least damaging...! I can see that, in this case, there would have been no way of them actually knowing WHO had committed the offence, so I suppose they did the only thing they reasonably could.

Going by what you had put in your OP though, I'm kind of interested to know what you thought of my response to THAT situation (as I understood it..)

[AndyHB]

I tend to agree with you, Eli.  The point of points is to punish a particular person's poor driving (or, at least, that's the theory).  If that leads to their losing their licence and, consequently their job, that is for them to think about.

However, isn't it part of human nature to want to take the punishment for others you care for?

[JJ]

"However, isn't it part of human nature to want to take the punishment for others you care for?"


Yes, how often have I nobly eaten the stuff put in front of me by other half or children?  Punishing indeed - plain pasta with burnt garlic,  lumps of unintended raw onions in a stew, sliced boiled egg on dry bread.  Yum.

[ecuworrier]

"However, isn't it part of human nature to want to take the punishment for others you care for?"


Yes, how often have I nobly eaten the stuff put in front of me by other half or children?  Punishing indeed - plain pasta with burnt garlic,  lumps of unintended raw onions in a stew, sliced boiled egg on dry bread.  Yum.

haha!

but who taught them?

GOD BLESS!

Peace and Love,

[ecuworrier]

from various radio discussions on speeding speed cameras etc .. there are many instances where the identitiy of the driver is contested or at least car owner sez wasn't me guv....  so of itself it isn't unusual other than the woman phoned up!...

loads of folks require the use of their cars in their proffessional life ... and the more you drive the more you are under pressure the more the opportunity or cuircumstance to make mistakes ... i think i am sympathetic to those drivers who end up losing their jobs assuming their driving to be normally good and safe... especially in this day and age and depending where they live it's not much fun....

GOD BLESS!

Peace and Love,

[tranchiebabe]

I certainly wouldn't confess to an illegal act which wasn't down to me, not even for my nearest and dearest.

[EliB]

However, isn't it part of human nature to want to take the punishment for others you care for?

I definitely think it's part of human nature to want to 'protect' those we care about...but "take the punishment for"?? Not so sure!! If we take the punishment for someone we care for, they're learning nothing, other than that actions DON'T have consequences...!
I think a punishment for ANY crime (however minor on the grand scale - although those seen as "minor" crimes can also have "major" consequences, ie speeding etc!) should be carried by the person responsible. Full stop!
I agree with Tangnefedd, I really don't see me carrying the legal can for someone I cared about! Yes, I'd try and help them deal with the punishment, but I wouldn't falsely admit!
(my friend's brother got a ban for drink driving - I told him to his face how disgusted I was with him for doing what he did and how disappointed I was....! He agreed he deserved what I'd said and that what he'd done was stupid in the extreme and he was banned and fined! Have I given him lifts to here there and everywhere? Yes! Because I care about him, but the punishment is HIS!!!!)

[ecuworrier]

that's cool... but ok what happens when ... status; livelihood or even at times life are at stake? ie big consequences that by affecting the person who has fuond themselves up **** creek actually affect one directly.... like a bit of speeding (to add to the points already accumulated for offences)... the problem of being supported by someone in a habitual situation of risk of offence ie a road user for work under pressure for 'crimes' deemed not really crimes (listen to all the irritated apologists on the radio )... well i can see how it becomes complex

GOD BLESS!

Peace and Love,

[Jan]

'Taking it on the chin for someone else'

I wouldn't do it and I wouldn't expect anyone to do it for me either

[EliB]

that's cool... but ok what happens when ... status; livelihood or even at times life are at stake? ie big consequences that by affecting the person who has fuond themselves up **** creek actually affect one directly.... like a bit of speeding (to add to the points already accumulated for offences)... the problem of being supported by someone in a habitual situation of risk of offence ie a road user for work under pressure for 'crimes' deemed not really crimes (listen to all the irritated apologists on the radio )... well i can see how it becomes complex

GOD BLESS!

Peace and Love,

Which crimes are "deemed not really crmes" ecu? They either are or they aren't!

[ecuworrier]

Which crimes are "deemed not really crmes" ecu? They either are or they aren't!

'crimes' deemed not really crimes (listen to all the irritated apologists on the radio .... meaning just that.... deemed by the folks who don't see the point of something being illegal... eg speeding ....  some of the stuff to do with drugs....  people who feel totally justified.... one can argue the toss about sense of entitlement.. and make no apologies accordingly


GOD BLESS!

Peace and Love,